Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

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Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby Kris@WLP » Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:51 pm

The page hit my email about one hour after I hit the road for JAMPCon. Unfortunately I wasn't able to upload it on the road.

But here it is.

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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby CmdrPowers » Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:52 pm

I love it, Kris! You and your new artist are doing excellent work.

Now keep it up. 8)
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby Okichobi » Thu Apr 27, 2017 1:05 am

So now there are two giants because...?

Look I'm trying really hard to give the comic a chance but its just kicking me where it hurts.
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby ShadowMage » Thu Apr 27, 2017 4:03 am

Okay, on the one hand, I was STARTING to warm up to Noah's mom when she began calming Sarah down. But then on the other hand, I saw that last panel and the red flags are going up again, because I really don't see how it's any business of hers how Sarah was enthralled. Unless, of course, she's pissed because her son was going on and on about Sarah while pointedly omitting the fact that SHE'S ALREADY PETER'S GIRL, in which case I say more power to her. Here's hoping she drills a lesson into her son's thick skull about respecting existing romantic relationships and not making moves on another guy's girlfriend.
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby Kris@WLP » Thu Apr 27, 2017 7:29 am

Okichobi wrote:So now there are two giants because...?


One of them is Dena, Noah's mom.

Who is a werelion.

She shifted to make sure things didn't get any more out of control.
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby Podoboo » Thu Apr 27, 2017 9:17 am

Okichobi: I don't know how much of previous chapters you remember, but it's already been established that while Sarah is pretty damn big for a wolf, she's NOT the only were that big. Noah, the werelion, is just as big as her, so it makes sense his relatives (the werelioness "giant" is his mom) would be of similar size. There's also Mr. Halbjornsen, a werebear, who I believe is a teacher of some sort and easily bigger than Sarah or Noah - in Book 2, he's shown to be able to manhandle Noah when he's being a nuisance.

ShadowMage: I think you're underestimating the significance of Sarah being a thrall rather than just a normal were. If you'll remember, in Book 1 they were considering killing both Sarah and Peter over the incident because someone being a thrall is not only a danger to every were around them (remember Sarah's first night as a wolf, Peter talks about how weres are taught from birth not to even play at using tooth or claw and thralls aren't) but also a danger to all of were kind (think of all the damage control Nero has had to do to cover up who/what 'Parkie' really is). This is no trivial matter like "why does this girl have so many tattoos" or "who let her get a nose piercing" it's about the safety of everyone in that class, her son included. While I'm sure she's got a few things to say to Noah and then some, the fact that there's effectively a toddler armed with an AK in the classroom is probably something she should be concerned about and asking "who gave this child a gun" seems entirely reasonable.
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby Kris@WLP » Thu Apr 27, 2017 9:39 am

Podoboo wrote:There's also Mr. Halbjornsen, a werebear, who I believe is a teacher of some sort and easily bigger than Sarah or Noah - in Book 2, he's shown to be able to manhandle Noah when he's being a nuisance.


Hal is one of Sarah's classmates. Of course, he's pretty big even in human form, so you're not incorrect to call him "mister."
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby ShadowMage » Thu Apr 27, 2017 2:05 pm

Podoboo wrote:Okichobi: I don't know how much of previous chapters you remember, but it's already been established that while Sarah is pretty damn big for a wolf, she's NOT the only were that big. Noah, the werelion, is just as big as her, so it makes sense his relatives (the werelioness "giant" is his mom) would be of similar size. There's also Mr. Halbjornsen, a werebear, who I believe is a teacher of some sort and easily bigger than Sarah or Noah - in Book 2, he's shown to be able to manhandle Noah when he's being a nuisance.

ShadowMage: I think you're underestimating the significance of Sarah being a thrall rather than just a normal were. If you'll remember, in Book 1 they were considering killing both Sarah and Peter over the incident because someone being a thrall is not only a danger to every were around them (remember Sarah's first night as a wolf, Peter talks about how weres are taught from birth not to even play at using tooth or claw and thralls aren't) but also a danger to all of were kind (think of all the damage control Nero has had to do to cover up who/what 'Parkie' really is). This is no trivial matter like "why does this girl have so many tattoos" or "who let her get a nose piercing" it's about the safety of everyone in that class, her son included. While I'm sure she's got a few things to say to Noah and then some, the fact that there's effectively a toddler armed with an AK in the classroom is probably something she should be concerned about and asking "who gave this child a gun" seems entirely reasonable.



I'm well aware of Sarah's, ah... 'condition'. I have read the entire comic from beginning to the present page. But it's been indicated and outright stated at more than one point in the comic that Sarah has gained a great deal more control over herself in wolf form than she did in her early period of being a thrall. She no longer acts like a hyperactive puppy on steroids in wolf form when under stress. Now, she acts like a scared puppy whose first instinct is to grab her security blanket (Peter) and cower in the corner waiting for the scary stuff to go away.

So, no. I'm not underestimating her danger factor at all, because unless I'm mistaken (Kris, feel free to step in and correct me if I'm wrong), Sarah's danger factor has gone down considerably from what it once was. If anything, I'm overestimating Noah's mental capacity, seeing how that phenomenal retard of a jock is apparently too busy thinking with the (comparatively) small head in his pants to mention important details to his mom such as, "Oh, by the way, this girl I'm so fixated on? She's a THRALL, and she's already spoken for by none other than the guy who turned her into a thrall in the first place".
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby Podoboo » Thu Apr 27, 2017 4:46 pm

Kris: I actually called him "mister" because that's how he was introduced in the comic by the 'instructor' of the were class. So I just kinda assumed.

ShadowMage: Yes, you know that Sarah isn't as dangerous as she was previously. I know this, our main characters know this. But this is the first time that these werelionesses are hearing that she's a thrall at all. It has nothing to do with how dangerous Sarah actually is, but how dangerous thralls in general are. We've seen that, if you'll excuse the continued metaphor, this toddler is shown how dangerous guns are and they can't play with it and such. We know that, unless really provoked, this toddler isn't going to use the gun they were handed on anyone. But if you walked into a room and found out a toddler had a gun, would your first assumption be "Oh, this person is probably fine, I'm sure everyone involved knows what they're doing"?

From Noah's perspective, Sarah wasn't introduced to him as a thrall initially, he just ran into her which is when he called his mom and told her about the then-unknown girl. He still has the hots for her, and he's got a pretty big ego/sense of self importance. So he's probably got that "just because there's a goalie doesn't mean you can't score" mentality, thinking that since he's a beefcake Sarah will prefer him to Peter without actually paying attention to their relationship. And between the fact that he knows she's not a dangerous thrall, and that he told his mom about her before finding out she was a thrall, he didn't want to be like "Oh yeah, and apparently she's only been a were for two months" and end up with egg on his face. So he probably thinks that her being a thrall, and her being with Peter, are both unimportant in his pursuit of her, but he also knows enough that his mom/aunt would probably be more prohibitive of him going for her if they knew she was a thrall. In his head, my guess is that he was going to win Sarah over, she'd be his, he could show her off to them, she'd be behaving because she digs Noah, and then he'd be like "Oh yeah, she's a thrall but don't worry I've got all this shit under control."
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby matteso585 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:42 pm

What are Dena's clothes made of?
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby ShadowMage » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:13 pm

Podoboo wrote:Kris: I actually called him "mister" because that's how he was introduced in the comic by the 'instructor' of the were class. So I just kinda assumed.

ShadowMage: Yes, you know that Sarah isn't as dangerous as she was previously. I know this, our main characters know this. But this is the first time that these werelionesses are hearing that she's a thrall at all. It has nothing to do with how dangerous Sarah actually is, but how dangerous thralls in general are. We've seen that, if you'll excuse the continued metaphor, this toddler is shown how dangerous guns are and they can't play with it and such. We know that, unless really provoked, this toddler isn't going to use the gun they were handed on anyone. But if you walked into a room and found out a toddler had a gun, would your first assumption be "Oh, this person is probably fine, I'm sure everyone involved knows what they're doing"?

From Noah's perspective, Sarah wasn't introduced to him as a thrall initially, he just ran into her which is when he called his mom and told her about the then-unknown girl. He still has the hots for her, and he's got a pretty big ego/sense of self importance. So he's probably got that "just because there's a goalie doesn't mean you can't score" mentality, thinking that since he's a beefcake Sarah will prefer him to Peter without actually paying attention to their relationship. And between the fact that he knows she's not a dangerous thrall, and that he told his mom about her before finding out she was a thrall, he didn't want to be like "Oh yeah, and apparently she's only been a were for two months" and end up with egg on his face. So he probably thinks that her being a thrall, and her being with Peter, are both unimportant in his pursuit of her, but he also knows enough that his mom/aunt would probably be more prohibitive of him going for her if they knew she was a thrall. In his head, my guess is that he was going to win Sarah over, she'd be his, he could show her off to them, she'd be behaving because she digs Noah, and then he'd be like "Oh yeah, she's a thrall but don't worry I've got all this shit under control."



That hardly seems fair to me. If Sarah's thrall status were that big of an issue, you'd think Debbie (or at the very least, Jean's dad) would've notified Dena that one if the class members was a somewhat recently-created thrall BEFORE she and Noah's aunt came to visit. If they didn't tell them, I can only assume that it was because they felt that Sarah had gained enough control (or that Peter had enough control OF her in her wereform) that her thrall status wasn't noteworthy as a reason for caution.

If they didn't feel that way, and still didn't tell Dena about Sarah's condition, that strikes me as grossly negligent. And while I can sort of understand that kind of negligence coming from Debbie (considering the way she handled--or rather, DIDN'T handle-- Sarah's first meeting with the rest of the Were group at school), it's far too out-of-character for Jack. He's the fucking PACK LEADER of the town's werewolf community-- if he thought that Sarah was a potential threat to out-of-town visitors (OR their relatives living in town, i.e. Noah) who were also weres, he would've warned them beforehand for sure. But since he didn't, it seems fairly safe to say Sarah's threat level has gone down considerably, to the point where it's not essential to inform strangers about it.
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby Podoboo » Sat Apr 29, 2017 12:32 pm

Again, you're looking at things from an external, relatively objective point of view. It's easy for us to say "Oh, they weren't told because there was no need to tell people, she's not a threat." But that's not going to be the immediate conclusion that others are going to jump to as to why they weren't told.

Others from outside the community can see Sarah as a threat or assume she would be one, without it being the case that the community sees her as one, or her actually being one.
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby ShadowMage » Sat Apr 29, 2017 2:47 pm

Podoboo wrote:Again, you're looking at things from an external, relatively objective point of view. It's easy for us to say "Oh, they weren't told because there was no need to tell people, she's not a threat." But that's not going to be the immediate conclusion that others are going to jump to as to why they weren't told.

Others from outside the community can see Sarah as a threat or assume she would be one, without it being the case that the community sees her as one, or her actually being one.


What I'm saying is that I feel Dena is being rather nosy and more than a bit paranoid. If the rationales and behavior of the pack leadership throughout this comic (as well as their discussions about other packs) are any indication, it seems fairly obvious that all were packs in the U.S. are headed by individuals who KNOW how to make sure their pack functions as expected without anyone having to die (to protect the public or the secret of the weres' existence), if death can be avoided, as is the case with Sarah. In other words, it seems to me that one if the qualifications for a were to be a pack leader is that they have to know how to both keep peace between members of the pack, AND prevent paranoia among pack members about potentially dangerous members such as thralls. Jack obviously knows how to do this, and so does Con Nero. How the hell do you think they've managed to keep order in the pack with a psychotic fuckbucket like Gus Cramer around?

Dena wouldn't have allowed her son to attend school in that town if she didn't think the local were community had the ability to keep itself stable. The fact that she DID allow Noah to go to school in that town implies that she trusts Jack as a pack leader to make sure that the pack's internal affairs don't drag in her son or get him in trouble or danger. So when she starts prying into the details of Sarah's enthrallment, I can only assume that she's either being paranoid, OR that she spoils her son and/or condones his pursuit of a woman who is already taken, in which case she's officially on my shitlist--WHICH IS THE OVERALL POINT I'VE BEEN MAKING THIS ENTIRE TIME.
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby tHEfOOL » Sun Apr 30, 2017 10:40 am

I have the feeling that Other were packs deal with thralls and their creators in a much different fashion, especially considering that in other species a thrall probably isn't going to be twice the size of All the other pack members. At the beginning of the comic the general consensus of the pack leadership was that he gets her under control now or we have to kill them both, but they were pretty hesitant because they figured they might lose half the pack trying to take Sarah down.
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby stormydragon » Sun Apr 30, 2017 12:22 pm

Podoboo wrote:while Sarah is pretty damn big for a wolf, she's NOT the only were that big. Noah, the werelion, is just as big as her, so it makes sense his relatives (the werelioness "giant" is his mom) would be of similar size. There's also Mr. Halbjornsen, a werebear, who I believe is a teacher of some sort and easily bigger than Sarah or Noah - in Book 2, he's shown to be able to manhandle Noah when he's being a nuisance.


My tinfoil theory is that Peter is actually Sarah's size too (hence the giant penis), but a lifetime of parental abuse has left him with an inferiority complex that has prevented him from fully transforming, and that the climax of the series is going to him having a "Popeye moment" when forced to take on Gus Cramer.
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Re: Page 386 (Book 4 Pg. 8) 4-27-2017

Postby ShadowMage » Mon May 01, 2017 12:13 am

stormydragon wrote:
Podoboo wrote:while Sarah is pretty damn big for a wolf, she's NOT the only were that big. Noah, the werelion, is just as big as her, so it makes sense his relatives (the werelioness "giant" is his mom) would be of similar size. There's also Mr. Halbjornsen, a werebear, who I believe is a teacher of some sort and easily bigger than Sarah or Noah - in Book 2, he's shown to be able to manhandle Noah when he's being a nuisance.


My tinfoil theory is that Peter is actually Sarah's size too (hence the giant penis), but a lifetime of parental abuse has left him with an inferiority complex that has prevented him from fully transforming, and that the climax of the series is going to him having a "Popeye moment" when forced to take on Gus Cramer.


Fifty bucks says Kris will shoot this theory down because he is stubbornly and obsessively fixated on keeping Peter as the ultimate beta male. Though it would be nice if Kris surprised us and actually gave Peter some fucking character development and progression.
Whenever I see bar-1, all I can think is... how the f**k is it even possible to abuse Sierra Mist? I mean, maybe with AMP or Red Bull, but... what was I talking about?

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